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---Transcript---Damyan So today we're talking about anti-aging. Retinol, which has been the gold standard anti-aging ingredient able to tackle everything from wrinkles and dark spots to skin tone and texture is now being challenged.  Damyan Bakuchiol which is a new ingredient has come up lately as a natural alternative offering similar benefits without the irritation, that's typical for retinol. So is but could your oil really worth all the hype? That's what we'll talk about today.  Damyan So the big question is this - What do people with great skin do differently to have that? How did they achieve a great look without using celebrity beauticians or spending a paycheck to re-stock their beauty cabinet? What are their mindsets, their approaches, their rituals, the products and tools they use? That is the question and as podcast will give you the answers. My name is Damyan Nikolov and welcome to Skincare Secrets.  Damyan Hi everyone, welcome to another episode of the Skincare Secrets show. Today we have joining on the phone Dr. Ratan Chaudhuri founder and chief scientist of Sytheon - the company behind Sytenol A, also known as Bakuchiol which has been written so much about lately.  Damyan He has been in the cosmetic industry for over 25 years. He's a member of the Society of Cosmetic Chemists, a reviewer for scientific journals, a speaker. He has published over 80 scientific papers and has more than 100 patents to his name.  You know everyone sees the glossy ads showing the brand name products in the beauty industry but it's actually people like Ratan Chaudhuri who drive the innovation in the space, who actually come up with newer better ways to help people with their skincare needs. And I celebrate people like you who have been making progress happen and I'm so excited to have you on the show. So thank you for joining.  Dr. Ratan Chaudhuri Thank you.  Damyan We'll try and answer the question today is Bakuchiol really worth all the hype? It's plant based ingredient which has been written up a lot lately. Scientists have known Bakuchiol for a while. And it's retinol-like effects and studies have appeared as long as five years ago.  Damyan And it's an ingredient that's actually been used for many years. Certainly popular in the Ayurvedic circles etc.. I'm curious why Bakuchiol is a hot topic now over the last sort of nine to 12 months? Would you give us your opinion? Dr. Ratan Chaudhuri Well retinol, everybody knows how great things are. And if you can come up with a skin get active ingredient with all the major benefits of retinol but none of the problems that would be ideal solution.  Dr. Ratan Chaudhuri And Sytheon was first company to bring highly pure Bakuchiol in skincare market and Sytheon has also generated good science to validate its application in anti aging skin protection and anti acne. Before that it wasn't known that it can be used for a topical application.  Dr. Ratan Chaudhuri But the good thing happen in June 2018 dermatologists from University of California Davis carried out a comperative anti aging clinical study between Bakuchiol that is Sytenol A and retinol and they published this work in British Journal of dermatology, it's a very well-known and highly reputed dermatology journal.  Damyan Yep.  Dr. Ratan Chaudhuri Then people read this publication. Key opinion leaders from many different beauty industries. And then they started writing good things for Bakuchiol. And good press is this still continuing. And because Sytenol A really satisfies this unmet, natural, original, alternative market.  Dr. Ratan Chaudhuri But just for your information, Sytheon has not done any PR. This is all kind of key opinion leaders and also dermatologists. They started writing good things about Bakuchiol and that actually brought this product to market.  Damyan That's fantastic. That's absolutely fantastic. Nothing beats a product that works. No marketing can accomplish the kind of stuff you've seen over the last six to nine months. In the amounts of press I saw you Refinery 29, I saw Vogue, I saw maybe two, three dozen publications, major publications, report this. So congratulations on all the good press you've gotten.  Damyan I wanted to get a little bit into the science and maybe you can help us understand how Bakuchiol is different and how is it similar to retinol?  Dr. Ratan Chaudhuri Well structurally there is no similarity between retinol and Backuhiol. If we look at functionally, yes, meaning it behaves retinol-like. But the problem with retinol - it causes skin irritation, sensitization, it is also not photochemically or hydrolytically stable.  Dr. Ratan Chaudhuri So you cannot also use this product during the day. That's why all those people use during the night. But that is not the case with Bakuchiol or Sytenol A from Sytheon. It's very easy to formulate with and now we can use it during the day. Damyan Yeah, for retinol I know, for many people have sensitive skin and even people without sensitive skin - you have to start with very low dosage. You have to start using it a few times a week. Gradually increase the percentage. Gradually increase the frequency of using it to build up tolerance.  Damyan Because correct me if I'm wrong but that the process that it works is through inflammation, as in causes an inflammatory response in the skin. While it's helping with skin turnover and that's something that does not happen with Bakuchiol.  Dr. Ratan Chaudhuri You are right.  Damyan And I know retinol is not necessarily compatible with certain ingredients. For example, certain acids or benzo peroxide. Do you see that kind of issue with Bakuchiol or no? Dr. Ratan Chaudhuri No, not really. I mean Bakuchiol is very easy to formulate with. You don't need to go to the dark room to formulate and it also has excellent storage stability. You would be lucky with retinol products if you can get one year of storage. But that is not the case of Bakuchiol or Sytenol A-containing products.  Damyan Yes. So it would be safe to say it's appropriate for all skin types?  Dr. Ratan Chaudhuri Absolutely. Yes.  Damyan OK. Very well. And I wanted to ask you how does it actually work on the skin? What happens when you apply Bakuchiol? What's the mechanism that it's helping? And what is it helping with in terms of the different anti aging concerns that people may have?  Damyan And related to that - How long would it normally take for people to see results applying Bakuchiol?  Dr. Ratan Chaudhuri Well, Bakuchiol seems to be activating multiple genes and proteins that are involved for reversing aging. More specifically collagen, everybody knows what role collagen plays in.... Damyan Yep, those are building blocks of the skin that give the skin the firm supple texture that it has.  Dr. Ratan Chaudhuri Exactly. Yes. And you start seeing results two to four weeks I would say more towards four weeks you start seeing the results. And you don't need to use a lot. 1.5 to 1 percent is good enough.  Damyan And in terms of the actual symptoms - so certainly texture, fine lines, wrinkles is something that it helps. I was reading that hyper pigmentation and dark spots is also an area where it has a similar benefit as retinol. Is that the case? Dr. Ratan Chaudhuri That is true. The work UC Davis California has done and they have really shown that it reduces fine lines, wrinkles, hyper pigmentation. And the good thing about Sytenol A is it does not have any side effects.  Dr. Ratan Chaudhuri In the case of retinol, you do see facial skin scaling and stinging. And UC Davis dermatologists actually concluded that Bakuchiol is compatible to retinol in its ability to improve photoaging and is much better tolerated than retinol. So that's a good statement these scientists have made. Damyan Yep. I wanted to ask you, I didn't see any work done with respect to acne and symptoms related to acne. Do you have an opinion on that side? Dr. Ratan Chaudhuri In fact, we have done some work, internally, at Sytheon and also published some data. Yes, it does have. By itself it works well but if you add salicylic acid or niacinamide it gives you even better results. And quite a few companies have started using this product for anti acne.  Damyan OK. Excellent. So you alluded a little bit to the study in the British Journal of Dermatology. It was a 12 week application side by side with point five percent both retinol and Bakuchiol and the results were phenomenal.  Dr. Ratan Chaudhuri Yeah that's true.  Damyan That study was done with Sytenol A, correct? Dr. Ratan Chaudhuri Yes. The quality is very important because all Bakuchiols are not created equal. And all these safety studies all the clinical studies are done with Sytenol A-grade Bakuchiol.  Damyan Yeah that's fantastic. I saw everywhere across the literature and also in the publications everyone cited Sytenol A/Bakuchiol as the ingredient that's really the only alternative to retinol that's proven results at this point. I know people are studying a bunch of others but there's no one else who's shown actual results other than Sytenol A/Bakuchiol.  Dr. Ratan Chaudhuri Yeah. Another thing is a lot of anti aging products available in the market but no one has actually done a side by side comparison with the retinol. And everybody knows retinol is a gold standard.  Damyan It's a high bar, you know. I mean if you have to be really confident to compare yourself to the gold standard.  Dr. Ratan Chaudhuri Yeah. Because we did a lot of signs that was indicative and that is the reason we went ahead and did the clinical study and then independently UC Davis California dermatologist. They also did the clinical study so basically validating what we knew long time ago.  Damyan I'm curious why did you focus on this? Obviously you read a lot of stuff, you developing a lot of different things. Why did you focus on this at the beginning to start with? Dr. Ratan Chaudhuri When I got interested in this product there was a lot of literature. It is an antioxidant anti inflammatory and also it has its effect on the mitochondria that are sudden so inflammatory biomarkers down regulated by Bakuchiol.  Dr. Ratan Chaudhuri And then I looked into that and obviously you just cannot use any kind of Bakuchiol. It has to be purified so that it does not have any other side products which are kind of not needed or not good for the skin.  Dr. Ratan Chaudhuri And then when we did the gene expression profiling it was indicated and then we did a side by side gene expression profiling Sytenol A-grade Bakuchiol and retinol and that actually was indicative. Damyan I wanted to ask you to actually make a prediction. So it took a number of years to develop this thing. 2018 was maybe an inflection point when the study came out and now you see maybe half a dozen or so mainstream brands already starting to use this in your collection. What do you think the future is for Satynol A-grade Bakuchiol. Dr. Ratan Chaudhuri Huge! If you look at Purafarm, they are using Sytenol-A grade Bakuchiol. In fact, they're writing it on their label. Then that for example I cannot name a couple of multinational companies or have also read looking at this one.  Dr. Ratan Chaudhuri So I would say it will be the gold standard a new gold standard in anti aging. I have no doubt about that one. Because it's a well-defined material. It has science behind product. I'm sure a day will come I will be gone but Sytenol A will still be here.  Damyan Fantastic. Thank you very much I appreciate all the insights on the company and also on Bakuchiol. Thank you on behalf of all the listeners of the podcast.  Dr. Ratan Chaudhuri Thank you.  Damyan This was Dr. Ratan Chaudhuri, everyone. Inventor and chief scientist behind Sytenol A or Bakuchiol, which has been the actual ingredient behind all the hype of Bakuchiol lately.  Damyan I did want to mention that the literature Dr Chaudhuri provided me with cites that it should be used at a point five to one percent concentration. The study that was done and published last year was at point five concentration.  Damyan It is important as you buy a product or look for this ingredient to make sure that it's a concentration that actually delivers efficacy as opposed to something that purely makes a marketing claim.  Damyan So that's all for today. Thank you for listening. If you enjoy the Skintech review. Please share it. Don't forget to subscribe and keep listening. Thank you and I'll see you next time.